Lorenzo says:
"'We'll cast [the house of Hauteville] into the sea and bring the island back to Christ!'" (p. 333)
Everard thinks:
"To the Inquisition, when it gets founded. To the persecution of Jews, Muslims, and Orthodox Christians. To the burning of heretics." (ibid.)
Lorenzo:
"'You're a Saxon... Charlemagne sprang from your country, Manfred. Let us stand ready to be knights of a new Charlemagne!'" (p. 334)
Everard:
"As a matter of fact, Everard recalled, he was a Frank, who massacred the Old Saxons with Stalin-like thoroughness. But the Carolingian myth has taken hold." (ibid.)
(Two Charlemagnes: historical and mythical.)
Emil Volstrup:
"'The thirteenth century was the century in which medieval society lost its earlier measures of freedom, tolerance, and social mobility. Heretics were burned, Jews were herded into ghettos when they were not massacred or expelled, peasants who dared to claim some rights suffered a similar fate.'" (p. 378)
The Middle Ages invented Nazi treatment of Jews.
I know someone who thinks that animal and human consciousness involve so much suffering that it would have been better if there had never been any consciousness. Imagine a time criminal who tries to prevent the formation of stars and planets that can generate life. A very negative interpretation of Buddhism implies the same conclusion but I think that meditation is beneficial here and now.
8 comments:
That friend must have led a very sheltered life before being exposed to reality.
Kaor, Paul!
And it was precisely from the fierce and savage Middle Ages that we TRULY got both ordered freedom under the rule of law and a true science. For every foolishness and barbarity there was a corresponding benefit and good.
Ad astra! Sean
The Middle Ages didn't invent Nazi treatment of Jews, and two points illustrate this:
a) medieval definitions of Judaism were -religious-, not ethnic. If a Jew converted to Christianity, he became a Christian. Even the Spanish hostility to -conversos- was based not on 'race', but on suspicions (often justified) that the conversion was insincere and the Jew (or Muslim) was still practicing the other faith in secret.
b) medieval Catholicism did not want to -wipe out- the Jews; it wasn't even really interested in converting them -en masse-, though it would take individuals.
This was because its theology required Jews to be still present at the End Times (to simplify somewhat).
Real exterminationist hatred of Jews was a -secular- phenomenon in medieval society; in the Papal States, Jews were subject to civil disabilities but were never expelled -en masse- as they were from some European states by monarchs.
The Middle Ages didn't invent Nazi treatment of Jews, and two points illustrate this: a) medieval definitions of Judaism were -religious-, not ethnic. If a Jew converted to Christianity, he became a Christian. Even the Spanish hostility to -conversos- was based not on 'race', but on suspicions (often justified) that the conversion was insincere and the Jew (or Muslim) was still practicing the other faith in secret. b) medieval Catholicism did not want to -wipe out- the Jews; it wasn't even really interested in converting them -en masse-, though it would take individuals. This was because its theology required Jews to be still present at the End Times (to simplify somewhat). Real exterminationist hatred of Jews was a -secular- phenomenon in medieval society; in the Papal States, Jews were subject to civil disabilities but were never expelled -en masse- as they were from some European states by monarchs.
(From SM Stirling.)
The two points that I had in mind were Jews having to wear a distinctive yellow emblem and ghettoes. I take the points about the difference between religion and ethnicity and about the uniqueness of 20th century industrial genocide.
That point about Jews and End Times in Christian belief is highly topical. Some Christians think that the end has been at hand since the founding of the State of Israel. Some think that conflict in the Middle East is a Good Thing because it will kick off Armageddon.
Paul: I don't expect supernaturalist reasoning to make sense in my terms.
Note that in the Middle Ages, making religious minorities wear distinctive clothing and so forth was widespread -- in Muslim countries, Christians often had to wear special hats, were forbidden from riding horses or donkeys in the presence of Muslims, etc.
Sumptuary laws in many parts of the world also required specific social groups (classes, castes, etc.) to wear special clothing and forbade them from wearing that of superior groups.
Kaor, Mr. Stirling!
I already knew, in bits and pieces, of how Medieval Christians regarded and treated Jews. Too often, badly. But not, as you said, with exterminationist hatred of the kind seen in the later 19th century in the weird stew of pseudo-Darwinist racism, socialism, and extreme nationalism, etc., that contributed to the rise of National Socialism.
Ad astra! Sean
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