Tuesday, 5 December 2017

The Elite

Gullberg is the (fictional) head of the small secret Section of Swedish Security that spies on members of Swedish Security. See here.

"[Gullberg]'s model was the legendary James Jesus Angleton, who had a similar position in the C.I.A., and whom he came to know personally."
-Stieg Larsson, The Girl Who Kicked The Hornet's Nest (London, 2010), Chapter 5, p. 110.

(For Angleton, see image.)

"[Gullberg] met Angleton, and he got to drink whisky at a discrete club in London with the chief of M.I.6. He was one of the elite." (p. 119)

It was suggested in the combox here that such a small and secret group as this Swedish Section might not be noticed even by the Time Patrol although the Patrol does have people in military intelligence. However, during the Cold War, the Patrol would have to know about the activities of people like Angleton and C (Fleming's "M," le Carre's "Control"). Consequently, I think that they would also know about Gullberg meeting Angleton and drinking with C.

At this point, the fictional narratives of Poul Anderson and of Stieg Larsson almost meet.

16 comments:

Sean M. Brooks said...

Kaor, Paul!

And what might have happened if one of these Swedish, British, or US Intelligence officers found out the truth about the Time Patrol? Might their deaths be faked and these men sent to the Exile planet?

Sean

Paul Shackley said...

Sean,
Memory erasure?
Paul.

Paul Shackley said...

In Stirling's CONQUISTADOR, those who learn the Secret have to go to the alternative Earth and stay there.

Sean M. Brooks said...

Kaor, Paul!

I doubt the Patrol would want to kill these men if they could avoid doing so. If not the exile planet, then either they would be mentally blocked from being able to reveal the Patrol or selective erasures of their memories about the Patrol seems more likely.

Yes, I remember how that was how the Commonwealth of New Virginia handled persons who found out about Earth2. That was what happened to Tom Christensen and his friend.

Sean

Paul Shackley said...

Sean,
Of course, we know that the Patrol mentally blocks its own members and, e.g., Castelar from speaking to anyone else about time travel or the Patrol.
Paul.

Sean M. Brooks said...

Kaor, Paul!

However, I did wonder how effective such a blocking might be. I can imagine someone like Don Luis writing an account of his run in with the Patrol away from anyone else and then leaving the document at a location where someone else would find it. Could the Patrol's blocking prevent him from doing that? He would have been writing an account, not telling anyone and not trying to directly give the document to anyone.

Sean

Paul Shackley said...

Interesting observation.

Sean M. Brooks said...

Kaor, Paul!

Thanks! Only goes to show devious human beings can be, with me speculating like that! Or, could the Patrol's mental blocking prevent such persons from writing about it? We don't know! All that we know is that it's said to prevent them from TALKING about the Patrol and time travel.

Sean

Ketlan said...

Sorry but surely the easiest solution is to kill the person/persons concerned either by a faked accident or a simple unsolved robbery/murder. I hate to be brutal but the simplest solution with the fewest potential complications must be the best.

Paul Shackley said...

Ketlan,
I wonder whether there are sections of the Patrol that would do that.
Paul.

Sean M. Brooks said...

Kaor, Ketlan and Paul!

Ketlan, first let me say I'm glad you are feeling better!

Yes, I have to agree that sometimes the brutal solution is the simplest way to solve a problem, esp. of the kind being discussed here. I would argue, however, that decent persons like Manse Everard and most of his Patrol colleagues would prefer, where possible, less ruthless methods. After all, merely working to preserve a timeline which has such monsters as Genghis Khan, Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, etc., is a hard enough strain on their consciences. Which leads me to conclude that if methods like the Exile planet, mind blocking, and/or selective memory erasure are possible, they will be used.

Paul, I can imagine that the Time Patrol does have agents or sections who do "wet work," if NOTHING else will do to resolve a dangerous problem. Manse Everard came close to killing the people in the Sino/Mongol exploration party we see in "The Only Game In Town" before he thought of a means of stranding these men in North America without needing to kill them.

Sean

Paul Shackley said...

Sean,
Also, there might be periods when morality is significantly different.
Paul.

Sean M. Brooks said...

Kaor, Paul!

But I think the unjust killing of human being is always and eternally wrong. Philosophers and theologians might debate things like tyrannicide, true, but such things are exceptions, not the rule.

Sean

Paul Shackley said...

Sean,
I agree that unjust killing is wrong - in fact, by definition: "unjust" has to mean "wrong." However, I am aware that many eras have not shared our ideas of what is unjust.
Paul.

Sean M. Brooks said...

Kaor, Paul!

But I think all human societies have penalized, one way or another, murder. Which is why I chose that example. Without SOME security of life is any kind of society possible?

Sean

Paul Shackley said...

Sean,
Society is impossible without some security. Nazis exterminated Jews - but not each other.
Paul.